Dave F. said... The press for this book has been great. I think one of the audio versions is going to win an award.
Evil Editor said... Yes but did we, the experts, like it?
Dave F. said... I thought it was fun and adorable. I liked it.
Robin S. said...I gotta say that I LOVED this book. Loved it. Reread most of it as soon as I'd finished it. And I hadn't expected to do that, or even to like it much.
BuffySquirrel said... i thought it was too episodic
Dave F. said...I tried to read "The Jungle Book" and that too is episodic.
freddie said...What did you love about it, Robin?
Robin S. said... freddie, I felt drawn into the world of the graveyard to the point where it became a believable place - and the episodic nature fit the story perfectly, describing Bod growing up. There was only one line in the entire novel I disliked - the one about 'it takes a graveyard to raise a child' bit. Echoes of PC bullshit resounded in my head with that one. Other than that, I was captivated.
BuffySquirrel said...it's a take on "it takes a village to raise a child", is all i didn't find the episodic aspect worked for me; i wanted the book to be more integrated, not jumping from place to place
Evil Editor said...But most of the places the episodes are set in return later with more significance.
freddie said... There were some things that felt a little extraneous, but I think Gaiman integrated most plot elements by the end.
Robin S. said...Yeah, buff, I get the village thing. That's why I loathed the line.
Kiersten said... I liked the episodic nature. It wouldn't have worked otherwise.
Robin S. said...I agree, Kiersten. The episodic nature was beautifully unfolded.
BuffySquirrel said...i'm sure it was meant to be episodic but it doesn't really matter whether it was or not; it didn't work for me
Dave F. said... Yeah, if you read this to a child, then each chapter has to hold a child's interest. That's another reason why it seemed so episodic. It was constructed to be episodic. One chapter every two years as he grew. The part I rolled my eyes and did my "oh really" was that a toddler can escape the house, drop the diaper and walk down the street into a graveyard. He's just a touch young at that point.
freddie said... I don't know, Dave. People with toddlers report their kids wander far and wide in a matter of seconds.
Robin S. said...Dave, My less-than-two year old got out of our house when I lived in Kansas, and I saw her about the time she was climbing a small hillside into the parkland behind our property. Only took a couple of minutes. She was a wily one. It happens!
Dave F. said... OK, children just don't get that far away from me. Uncle Dave is an eagle eyed watcher.
Evil Editor said... I liked the story, but when Bod went to that underworld place with the ghouls I thought it lasted too long. We need to know about the ghoul place because later a couple people get sent there, but...
BuffySquirrel said...i did not like the D&D aspects a lot of the book i did like but i wanted more of a consistent plot
freddie said..."D&D aspects? Dungeons and dragons?
BuffySquirrel said... towards the end when they're chasing down the bad guys one of the party fails to roll the die to escape from whatever kills them
Dave F. said...There is a chapter that drags there... I liked the multiple "jacks" appearing at the end. They all seemed so helplessly stupid and cartoonish after that first chapter.
BuffySquirrel said...i loved the whole semi-being-a-ghost thing
freddie said... I didn't really get how Bod was given ghost powers.
Dave F. said...He didn't have power, the Graveyard had the power of making him less visible and the spirits within the graveyard let him work their magic.
freddie said... I was rather amused by the use of the 33rd American President of the United States as a ghoul.
Dave F. said... I made a comment months ago that if you can get a kid past the first chapter, the rest is charming and sweet and much fun to read out loud. But even Gaiman said -- I will learn not to write knives and murders in the first chapter, someday... to paraphrase.
freddie said...What did you guys think about the overall theme of the book?
Kiersten said... Curses! I just wrote an intelligent comment--really, I'm not kidding--and blogger ate it. Go figure. I loved it, thought it was charmingly written, made me want to read Jungle Book. However, the Jacks at the end felt too random, as did most of the plot lines with them (the vampire and Miss Lupescu along with a random Ifrit and Mummy hunting them in caverns, etc). It felt too disconnected from the rest of the story. Still, I thought the end dealing with Jack Frost was very clever.
Robin S. said... To be honest, this read more like an adult novel about a childhood than about a childhood for children. I think that's why it resonasted with me.
BuffySquirrel said...i liked jack frost coming back as the too-good-to-be-true guy; that was well done
Kiersten said... Oh, I totally called that, Buffy. As soon as she met him in the graveyard, I thought, it's Jack.
BuffySquirrel said...oh yeah, but kids wouldn't get it
Chris Eldin said...Hi Everyone!! Just wanted to pop in for a quickie (it's 2am here).... I loved this book! But still, like Higher Power of Lucky, I cannot see 10-12 year olds getting into it. THe language and sentence structure are difficult. I loved the ghoul section, but it was a lot longer than others and made the book feel a bit unbalanced. This was my first Gaiman book. I am keen to read more.
BuffySquirrel said... eh, well, i don't much like Gaiman anyway (which is probably heresy in SFF circles)
Kiersten said... This is the first of his I've read. Wait, no, did he write Neverwhere?
BuffySquirrel said...yeah, he wrote Neverwhere the only book of his i've really liked is Good Omens
Kiersten said...Ah, yes, he did. Nevermind. Didn't much care for Neverwhere.
freddie said...He did write Neverwhere, Kiersten.
BuffySquirrel said...which also has a child growing up and yet manages not to jump around like a deranged butterfly
Kiersten said... All butterflies are deranged; have you ever seen them fly? I agree with everyone else that the ghoul chapter ran long. Also, loved that he used -escu for Miss Lupescu's name. The -escu ending is the Romanian equivalent of -son. Except she wasn't Romanian, which did kind of annoy me...
freddie said...My favorite is still American Gods. I've read it three times.
Dave F. said...Morpheus, the god of dreams is my idol. So much of what I want to try to write sounds like Morpheus.
BuffySquirrel said...you mean it sends people to sleep, dave?
Dave F. said... Buffy, go read the compilations of Sandman and you will understand what I said about Morpheus, the god of dreams. Dreams are so dangerous.
Robin S. said...I thought Gaiman's prose was wonderful. This is only the second book we've read that I've bought for other people as gifts. That's how much I admired it.
And again,I think this reads like a book that adults 'get' more than children.
Evil Editor said...I thought the vocabulary was for older kids, but the writing style was for younger.
freddie said...The writing style was definitely for younger. Absolutely. Maybe he used a higher vocab for the adults. Or maybe it was all unconscious.
Dave F. said...That's something I noticed and forgot, EE. Gaiman does not use a children's vocabulary. He writes fairly high level.
Robin S. said...EE, you thought the writing style was for younger kids?
Evil Editor said... Yes, I thought it was pretty simplistic.
freddie said...He uses a high vocabulary, but his sentence structure isn't very complex. That's true of his novels and stories for adults, too.
Robin S. said... I think that simplicity is a good mask.
Dave F. said... oh yes, Robin, a story should cloak the most complex matters in simplicity and let the plainness of the words speak for themselves.
freddie said... So what was your favorite part of the novel? (Section or theme)
BuffySquirrel said...my favourite was definitely the ghostly powers
freddie said... I loved the witch character. Liza.
Kiersten said...Can't remember a particular favorite. I liked the dead poet still waiting for everyone to realize what they had lost when they buried his works with him ; ) Lots of clever bits.
Dave F. said...favorite - that first chapter is just so much fun, so scary, so lurid, and so inviting. I always say -- make my heart beat or my glasses fog. And I do like a good scare!
freddie said... Dave, I was just going to say the same thing, but blogger ate my comment. I loved the feeling of anticipation I got in reading the first chapter.
Dave F. said...I liked that Gaiman ended with a bit of teen angst -- boy/girl relationships. That's so a part of growing and leaving childhood.
BuffySquirrel said... i'm utterly sick of teen angst
Whirlochre said...Evening all. I'm here as a slipstream leech. I have the audio book and had intended to listen to it in order to suffuse the comment trail with reasoned analysis — but sadly, Son of Whirl nicked it in order to feed his pre-teen brain.
So if it's OK, I'll hang around to be spoiled. My angle? Currently more or less upright. To be honest, I'm coming at this from a comic book perspective. I like the fact that this guy writes comic books as well as novels.
Kiersten said...Whirl! Hey! I'm glad Son of Whirl got this. I can't wait until my kids are old enough to share fun books with.
Robin S. said...Hi Whirl, If you don't read this book, you're missing a good one.
Whirlochre said...I'm on it. Literally. Hence angle.
freddie said...Did anyone catch Gaiman on Colbert?
BuffySquirrel said...nah, that would be fangirly :D
Kiersten said... I was going to watch it but my kids descend like vultures whenever I try to play video on the laptop, and I wasn't sure it was friendly enough for them.
Whirlochre said...Haven't seen Colbert but I tuned into Gaiman's own reading. The opening with the knife. Not often writers read their own stuff. normally they pay Stephen Fry or Kerry Shale.
Kiersten said... Speaking of the little vultures, Dojo didn't take a nap today and is being a bit too much help typing these responses, so I'm off.
Evil Editor said... Did you notice how much better Kiersten's spelling was tonight?
Dojo said... Her spelling's nowhere near as good as mine. Now if only I could figure out that whole potty-training thing, I'd be out of here.
BuffySquirrel said... lol, Dojo and just put the book in a different dustjacket ;)
Dave F. said... Gaiman has a good voice and style for reading his own work. I think you are seeing his movie and comic book voice when he reads and that's why it's good. I think he hears the words in his head as he writes them. It's like a playwright.
Phoenix said...I have to admit I've listened to most of it. Perhaps since I was multitasking my way through it, I didn't find the ghoul section overly long. Or maybe it's just the difference between reading and listening. I'm loving it, but the true test, of course, is how KIDS like it. Newbery winner or not. Does anyone know how kids are truly responding? (Yes, I've been living under a rock the past 6 months. What of it?)
BuffySquirrel said...no clue about the kids no kids here
Whirlochre said...True, Phoenix — predicting kids is like watching water spurt from a fountain.
freddie said... You know, the weird thing is, I don't know how kids are responding to it. I was going to buy a copy for one of my nieces for her birthday, but my sister is a fundamentalist Christian, and I didn't think she'd react well to a book titled "The Graveyard Book" showing up at her door. I can't do that when I'm ordering from Amazon and having it shipped directly to her house. But maybe I'll do that when we're both visiting the folks next. This is a woman whose church believes the witchcraft in the Harry Potter books are real.
Robin S. said...Oh, freddie. Glad you got away from that crap.
freddie said...Yeah, but I'd like to clarify my parents never taught that crap. I mean, I know you probably weren't thinking that . . . but still.
BuffySquirrel said...lol, she ought to try casting some of the spells sometime that would disillusion her fast
freddie said... No shit, Buffy! I ought to use that the next time she starts in on that crap. Ah - thank you!!
Phoenix said...I just know that after this book I'm just going to go quietly stick my MG ms in the closet. Buffy, was it just the episodic nature you didn't like? I usually hate that, too, but here it didn't bother me. Maybe because he gave each chapter enough time to play itself out.
BuffySquirrel said...the episodic nature was a big issue for me but i also didn't like the D&D elements in the one sequence i dunno; for me the best things were the ghostly powers and jack frost's reincarnation as Harmless Friendly Man i never felt drawn into the book
Whirlochre said... What I liked about what I've heard so far — the kid walking up the hill — is that it's simply presented but offers muchness of potentially adult bizarre. I can see all sorts of mischief afoot, but I wonder — what will today's kids (goodness, I sound like an advert for detergent) make of it? Seems to point towards an horizon of grimness far, far from my own Sound of Music youth. Not that I sang along, of course. Ever.
Robin S. said...I agree, Whirl. It reads 'deceptively simple', with undercurrents. I like that. And yeah - I saw The Sound of Music, but I loved a 70's B movie wild child time.
Phoenix said...I find Robin liking it so much -- I dunno -- strange. Is it the character, the idea of the graveyard, or what that appeals most?
Evil Editor said... Robin's other favorite was also about ghosts. Coincidence?
freddie said... Yeah - this is outside your range of usual tastes, Robin. What's up with that? ; )
BuffySquirrel said... ghosts are great but they make me sad
Robin S. said...Hell, phoenix, I find Robin liking it so much, strange. I loved the concept; the world-building, and the humor (the way the gravestones are read is not only funny, it's a tale of its own about the actual lack of importance of what we choose to live by in each of our generations, or what we are taught to revere as important). I'd never have picked this book off the shelf. I hate to say it, EE, but you've been an eye opener.
freddie said... So the reason I asked about the Colbert Report (and quickly lost) was the point how Gaiman summed up the book. How would you sum it up?
Phoenix said...Yeah, on Colbert, Gaiman said all the live people were the ones kids had to watch out for.
Dave F. said...I sent my Nephew "STARDUST" for his daughter and never realized that one chapter early in the book had the conception (the act) described in it. They still tease me about that. Gaiman writes subversively about what he thinks children should know about. This book is no stranger to adult themes. That's why we like it.
freddie said...Stardust was actually really forgettable for me. I don't remember a thing about that book. Oh well. I guess I can always go back and read it again.
BuffySquirrel said... I much preferred Stardust to this book
Phoenix said...I didn't read Stardust but I saw the movie. I can only hope the book is better.
Whirlochre said... The live people thing is true.
BuffySquirrel said...hell is other people!
Dave F. said...I liked the thematic material of STARDUST but not the visualization of the movie. It is a story about growing up and falling in love. Well, more than that, it is a story about love between adults -- real love and not eye-glass steaming, panting, sweat-covered, heaving lust. Another movie I liked becase it had similar themes was "Corpse Bride." not by Gaiman, of course.
freddie said... Wait a minute, Buffy. I seem to remember that you liked the Graveyard Book upon finishing it. What happened?
BuffySquirrel said... i liked it, but i didn't love it
Phoenix said... Epitaphs. What most of us will be known by 100 years from now. I think that's more sad, Buffy, than ghosts.
BuffySquirrel said... ghosts as characters make me sad--their lives are over yet they're somehow still going on epitaphs are just pointless :D
Whirlochre said... The way things are going, future generations will live on forever as heaps of observable unwitnessed serverdump.
Robin S. said...Ewww, Whirl! But, then again, epitaphs being as pointless as they eventually are, what the hell.
Whirlochre said... Sorry Robin — I suppose it's a general question of how much the arena of kid's literature is changing.
Phoenix said...Maybe that IS it, Whirl. That so much has changed since I was the target audience for this book. Or maybe I've changed. But I was reading adult books when I was 9 because I didn't want all the syrup books for my age group were feeding me. Maybe that's why I like this book today.
Dave F. said... Gaiman is not afraid to write books with themes that scare ---
"The Day I Swapped my Dad for Two Goldfish"
"The Wolves in the Walls"
Two themes that might just inspire nightmares in kids.
Whirlochre said... So what kind of fantasy are we saying Gaiman nudges onto our nape?
Dave F. said...I think he's like JAWS --- primal fears.
-- of being unloved and left alone
-- the dark unknown
-- the unpredictable wish that comes true but not the way we thought it would
freddie said... I don't know, Whirl. I love how in Gaiman's stories you just sort of accept the supernatural world in juxtaposition with the real world. Always makes me feel like I've traveled back in time - even when the story is contemporary.
Robin S. said... Exactly what you said, freddie. That's it.
Evil Editor said... As I mentioneed at our last chat, there's a good chance the author will join us for the April chat.
Dave F. said...One of the reasons that the "Jacks" make such good villains is that they are shown to be clownish and incompetent. That's Gaiman's sneaky plot point for children that adults never see.
Robin S. said... I have only a few minutes before I have to go. But I have to say again, I really loved this book. Don't stretch my horizons too much farther, please, EE. My preconcieved notions about what is 'to be read' are folding up the tent - and that's a bit disconcerting.
sylvia said... Oh no! I fell asleep and missed the whole thing. ARGH Well, I'll belatedly say that I enjoyed the book and handed it to my 14-year-old to see what he thought of it. He grumbled a bit about the first chapter ("I'm not sure I want to be reading horror just before bed!") and I reassured him that the rest of the story was toned down. He read a bit that night and then fell asleep. The next night he stayed up past midnight to finish it (he's allowed to read in bed during the holidays but he usually passes out on the book within a short time). He loved it. He's a bit older than the target age group but he neither felt it was "too young" nor did he have any trouble following it. He did admit that he didn't realise that Silas was a vampire until close to the end.
fairyhedgehog said... I was sorry to miss this and it looked like a good chat. I wasn't really aware of the age the book was aimed at - I just enjoyed reading it. I love Gaiman's deceptively simple language. Of course, I grew up in the days when John Wyndham was state of the art. I think people wrote more simply in those days.
V. Dunn said... I bought The Graveyard book two weeks ago for this chat. Sigh... then missed the chat as usual. But I've enjoyed reading it. Y'all are a lot of fun. :-) To the folks who said that the language is too sophisticated for the age range, I'd just like to say that my 11yo (and learning disabled) son grabbed this book from me and read it over 5 very determined days. He loved it. Last Monday he took his own money and went and bought Coraline, by the same author. He finished reading that one, as well. And last night he asked (based on a TV show we were watching) for my copy of the Da Vinci Code. Now, I don't know that he'll actually read that last book, but his (brand new!) interest in reading novels (instead of just gaming magazines) is one of the most exciting things that's ever happened to me, as a parent. *happy dance* I need to go write Mr. Gaiman a letter of appreciation...
